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Was anyone else disappointed with how the story went for DMC5?

BlackAngel

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I wasn't disappointed at the story and characters, but I expected better from the developers to write a decent story. What really bothered me was the timeline that DMC4 and 5 takes place after DMC2. Because they're are a lot of inconsistencies of the timeline.

Like why was Dante from DMC2 got back to his old self from a quiet, mature, and stoic-like character? How come he can't use his Majin Form on the 4th game, but able to unlock it on the 5th game? (which it would explain how he got the Majin Form for Dante to use in DMC2) What happened with him and Lucia? There are many questions that should be answered.

It's like the devs just said, "Screw it. Let's just make the story mostly fanservice to our western audience. They don't care about the story. They just want more flashy stuff!" And they've failed to realize that a good story, and well written characters are just as important.
 

Vergil95

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I wasn't disappointed at the story and characters, but I expected better from the developers to write a decent story. What really bothered me was the timeline that DMC4 and 5 takes place after DMC2. Because they're are a lot of inconsistencies of the timeline.

Like why was Dante from DMC2 got back to his old self from a quiet, mature, and stoic-like character? How come he can't use his Majin Form on the 4th game, but able to unlock it on the 5th game? (which it would explain how he got the Majin Form for Dante to use in DMC2) What happened with him and Lucia? There are many questions that should be answered.

It's like the devs just said, "Screw it. Let's just make the story mostly fanservice to our western audience. They don't care about the story. They just want more flashy stuff!" And they've failed to realize that a good story, and well written characters are just as important.
They explained all this in the dmc 5 novel you can find the story on internet, in the novel set before dmc 5, dante return to dumari Island, via de marlie and meet Lucia and matier once more, and the explained a lot, how Dante escaped from hell in dmc 2, what happened after and the relationship between Lucia and dante
They care about the story, it's fan that can only complain about every **** and are not happy about anything

Majin form and sin devil trigger are two different form, Majin form is triggered only when dante is almost dying, it's some sort of measure of last resource, sin dt is well explained in dmc 5 as you can see
 

BlackAngel

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They explained all this in the dmc 5 novel you can find the story on internet, in the novel set before dmc 5, dante return to dumari Island, via de marlie and meet Lucia and matier once more, and the explained a lot, how Dante escaped from hell in dmc 2, what happened after and the relationship between Lucia and dante
They care about the story, it's fan that can only complain about every **** and are not happy about anything

Majin form and sin devil trigger are two different form, Majin form is triggered only when dante is almost dying, it's some sort of measure of last resource, sin dt is well explained in dmc 5 as you can see
What novel are you talking about? And the story you've told me was pretty much a poorly told story, how Dante escaped from hell then somehow conveniently came across Yamato without any trace of Vergil. And suddenly back to his old self from being a quiet person. It just doesn't make any sense. What the director should've done, is to create a remake of DMC2 to fix the problems of the story and characters to be more fleshed out.
 
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Vergil95

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What novel are you talking about? And the story you've told me was pretty much a poorly told story, how Dante escaped from hell then somehow conveniently came across Yamato without any trace of Vergil. And suddenly back to his old self from being a quiet person. It just doesn't make any sense. What the director should've done, is to create a remake of DMC2 to fix the problems of the story and characters to be more fleshed out.
What the director should do is give the middle finger to the ****ty game dmc 2 is and never talk about it again because nobody give a **** about that game
People just try to find an explanation on why Dante is serious in dmc 2 but the explanation is that the director of that game was drunk and did a ****ty game whit ****ty characters development
And fan should stop being little cry baby about every single ****, wow i really hope dmc 6 would be as bad as dmc 2 so fan can finally receive the game they deserve

It dosent even seems to be in a dmc fan base here everyone just complain about this series, my god
Capcom should have never released dmc 5, fun should have gone to hell and wait another 50 years for a dmc game or wait forever for what i care, if the fandom is so ****ing bad

The novel i was talking about is devil may cry 5 before the nightmare
The story is not poorly written , read the novel if you can first, don't complain about everything
 

BlackAngel

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What the director should do is give the middle finger to the ****ty game dmc 2 is and never talk about it again because nobody give a **** about that game
People just try to find an explanation on why Dante is serious in dmc 2 but the explanation is that the director of that game was drunk and did a ****ty game whit ****ty characters development
And fan should stop being little cry baby about every single ****, wow i really hope dmc 6 would be as bad as dmc 2 so fan can finally receive the game they deserve

It dosent even seems to be in a dmc fan base here everyone just complain about this series, my god
Capcom should have never released dmc 5, fun should have gone to hell and wait another 50 years for a dmc game or wait forever for what i care, if the fandom is so ****ing bad

The novel i was talking about is devil may cry 5 before the nightmare
The story is not poorly written , read the novel if you can first, don't complain about everything
So, you're saying that people should shut up and not criticize things, that the franchise needs to work on and expect some people to accept the way that it is? Look, not everyone is going to blindly enjoy what Capcom makes. And people should criticize what they don't like about the game, whether people agree or disagree.
 

Vergil95

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So, you're saying that people should shut up and not criticize things, that the franchise needs to work on and expect some people to accept the way that it is? Look, not everyone is going to blindly enjoy what Capcom makes. And people should criticize what they don't like about the game, whether people agree or disagree.
People should criticize, but should also talk about the good aspect, i only see criticism around here.... Also criticism should be made to improve, not just saying this is poor, this is **** ecc ecc

It look like we are in a nursery here where kid complain they didn't get they're candy

But let's move on, i just read the last chapter of vision of v, here we finally see the event that lead to vergil escape house and mundus minion attack, poor vergil
 
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Hungry Alien

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People should criticize, but should also talk about the good aspect, i only see criticism around here.... Also criticism should be made to improve, not just saying this is poor, this is **** ecc ecc

It look like we are in a nursery here where kid complain they didn't get they're candy

But let's move on, i just read the last chapter of vision of v, here we finally see the event that lead to vergil escape house and mundus minion attack, poor vergil
You really need to chill out about criticism. Yes the DMC story is poorly told and sometime really confusing for no reason, just stating that "no one care" (which is wrong btw because people actually care about it) won't change that fact. What you propose is to completely ignore the flaws of the serie and focus only on the good parts, that's just a recipe for a slow death. Never trying to improve on the bad parts and focusing only on the good parts will only halt the serie growth.

I know the serie got one of the worst treatment over the years with different director between games and poor decision from Capcom. But it isn't a reason to just give up on the bad parts. Pointing out flaws of the game and how it affect the game with a rational approach isn't being a spoiled brat, it's just loving the game without being blind and wanting it to do better.
 

Morgan

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@Vergil95 No offense, but legit question, how old are you?

I think it's more than a bit mindboggling and a hundred percent blind to come into a thread asking "Was anyone else disappointed with how the story went for DMC5" -- a phrasing that implies the OP is disappointed and wanted to see if anyone else shared that opinion -- and 10 pages of discussion later with a bunch of people agreeing more often than not, claim that nobody cares about the story to any particular game and whining about how people talking bad about the story are "crybabies", literally the only crybaby in here is you rushing to "vouch for the integrity"/"defend the honor" of a fictional story (and a fictional character, in Vergil's case) like Capcom is going to reward you for it with money or a job or as if Vergil himself will come out of the screen and hand you the Yamato because you're a better simp-- I mean, son.

Take it from someone that stopped supporting the series starting from the DMC HD Collection and thus has no monetary stake in this franchise anymore, who would literally have preferred the series die like Darkstalkers for the way Capcom kept stringing the fandom to shell out more and more money for re-released games and holding the future of the series ransom after the "fandom at large" already voted with their wallets to not support the reboot,

Grow the F up. People not saying what you want them to say about a series you like isn't going to kill the series any harder than Capcom's own crappy business decisions. Trust me, they can handle what people on the internet have to say about it.
 
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Demi-fiend

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What I meant to say was, the constant defeats in combat against other demons, combined with Nero's power within Yamato, made Vergil that much stronger when he became Urizen.

Unfortunately, this is where my headcanon ruins everything.

How many of you have played this?

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So, according to my theory, Vergil was actually trapped in V, and his Urizen half was just his subconscious acting automatically -- kind of like a very advanced version of sleepwalking. In my opinion, there was no one there, in the same sense you're not there when you're sleepwalking. Urizen is Vergil's advanced autopilot, since he speaks very slowly, claims to have lost some of his memories, and can only remember basic things such as Dante's name.

What does this have to do with Vergil?

Well, Vergil only just now decided to risk splitting himself in half, only because he didn't know which side he consciousness would end up in.

He "lost the coin toss" (where he would have a 50/50 chance to end up in either half) and ended up in his human form.

Whereas, Dante "won the coin toss" and ended up in his demon form.

Where was Dante's human half? Temporarily phased out by the combined power of Devil Sword Sparda and Rebellion.

Devil Sword Dante is his human half rendered subconscious -- which is why Urizen asked how he managed to gain so much power in his final boss battle.

Dante hated and suppressed his demon side, so it ended up taking over. I'm sure Dante would've just wanted to be a normal human with just enough strength to defeat Urizen -- instead, he became more or less deformed due to his own self-loathing.

Vergil suppressed his human side, and therefore, it took complete control and rejected his demonic side completely.

I know it looks like the opposite happened (Urizen rejecting V) but you need to remember how much V ended up regretting his actions both in the manga and in-game. He didn't have his demonic side to assuage his hidden guilt anymore.

Also, being beat up by a conga line of demons is a humbling experience, even for someone like Vergil. He finally was forced to admit that in a weakened state, he wouldn't be able to fight demons, like his brother Dante would have. He depended on the Yamato ever since it devil triggered him when he was young to save him from those demons who found him and his family.

V claims to have had little power left, but it was enough to control three full functioning demons who acted as his imaginary friends due his insanity from his rampant narcissism, loneliness, and constant PTSD from being tortured before being made to submit to Mundus and having his memories erased.

Arkham and Lady also had considerable amounts of power due to Arkham becoming a demon. Arkham's connection to Lady alone was enough to make her more powerful than other humans. In DMC3, her boss profile said she had had "little training" at that point so this supports that theory.

These demons were also on autopilot due to their being magical manifestations of Vergil's nightmares.

So, demonic power can:

  • render a defeated demon to become powerful (with the right steps) become human, then have your demon side gain power, then reconnect with said demonic half
  • grant a normal human enough power to be a force to be reckoned with, such as Lady through her connection to Arkham
  • make other normal humans (who have performed ritual sacrifices) nearly unstoppable Arkham and Sanctus. If you're wondering who Sanctus sacrified, it was himself. It was a risky move, but he most likely made a deal with whoever the demon emperor was at the time in order to be able to resurrect, like Arius did with Argosax.
  • allow humans to have just enough power to be a considerable threat (Agnus and Credo).

Now, why isn't Nico powerful? Well, I think she is.

Either her power hasn't fully awakened yet, or they have solely manifested in terms of her IQ.

"Tony Stark built an ark generator in a cave! With a couple of scraps!!"

That's almost the equivalent of Nico's accumulated power. She figured out how to re-calibrate Nero's own sword (in the novel) when Nero himself couldn't figure it out. It's also the reason why she can create such futuristic weapons in the back of a van with nothing but her own resources and a few discarded demon body parts. It's a more advanced version of Nero's demonic power ability absorption.

And if you're thinking: "But, she's always been this smart." Well, that's because her father, who already had high IQ, had been working with demons (Uroboros and Argosax) her entire life. So this means, just by working with demons, at least some humans are capable of harnessing power in their own way.

Agnus was also transformed when she was still young, so some of that power and/or additional IQ (on top of her already high IQ she has by default) would have just ended up being transferred in any case.

Some humans (such as the Holy Knights of Sparda) were able to fight low-to-mid level demons, but that's only because they've been training their entire lives, surrounded by demonic energy. Being a normal Holy Knight would feel somewhat more like a less powerful version of God Hand and less like Devil May Cry.
 

Carlos

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I liked Castlevania on Netflix and I'm a fan of Warren Ellis whose is a big presence in the American comic book scene.

I'm curious to see what his take on DMC could be.
I've been binge watching this on Netflix recently...

I loved the Castlevania show on Netflix, they didn't hold back on the content. I knew exactly when and where the story "unfolded" in the Castlevania storyline. Like, when Alucard and Maria was in the same screen at the same time, I immediately was like "Symphony of the Night" at it. Anything before that was basically the first 3 Castlevania games. After this point, it was SOTN. At some points, I went like "lament of innocence" especially the painting in the tower that leads to the bottom of the Belmont hold. In Season 3, they moved the story beyond the last Castlevania game. And all I could think is "What's gonna happen next?"

It was well written, well followed. Didn't make any plot holes. I'm sure that most hardcore Castlevania fans like myself will either pay attention to it, or just gloss over it. I am in the "glossing over it" camp. Those who pay attention to the little details will nitpick at it, will say there's plotholes.
 

Vergil95

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@Vergil95 No offense, but legit question, how old are you?

I think it's more than a bit mindboggling and a hundred percent blind to come into a thread asking "Was anyone else disappointed with how the story went for DMC5" -- a phrasing that implies the OP is disappointed and wanted to see if anyone else shared that opinion -- and 10 pages of discussion later with a bunch of people agreeing more often than not, claim that nobody cares about the story to any particular game and whining about how people talking bad about the story are "crybabies", literally the only crybaby in here is you rushing to "vouch for the integrity"/"defend the honor" of a fictional story (and a fictional character, in Vergil's case) like Capcom is going to reward you for it with money or a job or as if Vergil himself will come out of the screen and hand you the Yamato because you're a better simp-- I mean, son.

Take it from someone that stopped supporting the series starting from the DMC HD Collection and thus has no monetary stake in this franchise anymore, who would literally have preferred the series die like Darkstalkers for the way Capcom kept stringing the fandom to shell out more and more money for re-released games and holding the future of the series ransom after the "fandom at large" already voted with their wallets to not support the reboot,

Grow the F up. People not saying what you want them to say about a series you like isn't going to kill the series any harder than Capcom's own crappy business decisions. Trust me, they can handle what people on the internet have to say about it.
Just saying that this should be a dmc fandom and right now in almost every thread I only read people complain and never be happy about a single things, i don't care about capcom I'm not defending it, that's just my opinion
Well fortunately this is not the large fan base since i can only see 5 or 6 people writing in this forum

Also if you really didn't want to support the series than you should have stopped at devil may cry 2, that was a clear example of Capcom wanting to monetize the series

Personally i don't see the problem whit re release of game since it gives the opportunity to other people to finally play the game and to us the opportunity of replaying a better version of it
 

Morgan

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So, demonic power can:
  • make other normal humans (who have performed ritual sacrifices) nearly unstoppable Arkham and Sanctus. If you're wondering who Sanctus sacrified, it was himself. It was a risky move, but he most likely made a deal with whoever the demon emperor was at the time in order to be able to resurrect, like Arius did with Argosax.

The rest of the write-up is okay but this right here: Arius's deal with Argosax that came from absorbing his power in the botched ritual to resurrect him is a lot lot different than Sanctus's Ascension Ceremony that involved the use of Yamato and ascended various members of the order in different but similar ways. In Sanctus's instance he wasn't actually dead, just in critical condition after a headshot should have left his face as mincemeat, the way Dante's survived headshots and impalements and Vergil survived getting cut straight in half. It probably just took longer because Sanctus is old.

And the demon ruler at the time was Berial himself. Not even kidding you:

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"Demon Emperor who has been sealed away" = Mundus
"prince to the Demon Emperor [...] now faces ruling the Underworld alone" = Berial

I refuse to believe that Sanctus would have made a deal wtih weaksauce Berial to revive, and not a mention would be made about that pact or that it'd even work considering Berial gets punked by a quarter-demon and half-demon within a day. But that's Capcom's problem and their inability to tell a complete story in a single installment.

@Vergil95 Okay, so you generalized the entire fandom off of what a handful of people are saying here? Like, if you have an issue with Reddit go take it up with Reddit, don't bring that nonsense here like anyone is gonna understand the asterisk mess you consistently spew. I can't relate to being so insecure about other people's criticism about a franchise that I'd tromp in a thread about it to shout "criticism bad" and telling them how to """properly""" enjoy things based on a definition which involves them shutting their brains off and not thinking, only consuming and spending more money on an unsatisfactory product. That's still being a corporate simp.

If you wanna debate things such as character direction and canon like someone with a brain and something legitimate to say, you're free to cite actual canon or contradictions in canon to support your reasoning instead of calling people whiners and crybabies and pulling headcanon out of your rear and also incessantly complaining about any mention of DMC2 like it killed your dog and deserves a trigger warning. It was a silly game. Get over yourself. People are allowed to mention the silly game in greater discussions/criticisms about the timeline and the story of DMC5 precisely because DMC5 threw the timeline out of whack,
 

Morgan

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I forgot about that line.

Fine print always gets you in the end, even in a simplified storyline (compared to other franchises) like DMC.
Bold of you to think it was a line. They neeeeeeeever brought it up in the real game. Berial was just Conqueror of the Fire Hell and he was trash-tier as a boss. That blurb is from an art book. Capcom somehow struck "gold" in being able to split one whole game's story at least four ways and still have people praising them like they did no wrong, just because they thirst for any type of DMC content and pretend they have standards. It's like FFXV's "transmedia universe" all over again.
 

BrawlMan

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I forgot about that line.

Fine print always gets you in the end, even in a simplified storyline (compared to other franchises) like DMC.
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Jesus this topic has gone for 11 pages. What more can be added at this point?! I made my post clear. I love the story, it's almost as good as 3's and that fine by me. Sure, there are some weird pacing issues and time lapses, but it does not detract from the experience. Sure, you're essentialy getting an abridged remake of 3 with Nero added in the mix. But that is not exactly a bad thing. Well that and you're getting a Chaos Legion game, and the best Tree of Might game ever made. The best Chaos Legion game is Astral Chain tho. Astra Chain > V > Chaos Legion.

EDIT: Seriously, I don't know what some of you people were expecting. I'll add this life lesson.

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AgentRedgrave

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My only real problem with the story was I feel it did Lady and Trish dirty. They show up, get their asses kicked off screen, and needing rescuing.

Now I'm okay that they didn't get a lot of focus, the game is about Nero, Dante, and V/Vergil.

But they could have at-least be seen doing something cool. Like maybe before the guys went off a swarm of demons started approaching the van. Nico tosses Lady a pair of guns, and she and Trish are like "We got this" so Dante and the others can go after Urizen
 

Morgan

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EDIT: Seriously, I don't know what some of you people were expecting.
For anyone reading the above seriously here's a serious answer: Better. Some people were expecting better than a cheap clone of Tree of Might, Chaos Legion, and DMC3 that's somehow worse put together than each of its different parts.
 
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BrawlMan

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For anyone reading the above seriously here's a serious answer: Better. Some people were expecting better than a cheap clone of Tree of Might, Chaos Legion, and DMC3 that's somehow worse put together than each of its different parts.
Okay then. Everyone's allowed to have their opinion, but I swear some of you were expecting Capcom to give you the Sun (you would have to kill Mika if you want it), the Moon, and the entire galaxy. Some of y'all had reasonable expectations, while others were set too high. I already knew from the get go that 5 would be a better version of 4 with some elements of Bayonetta and DmC, gameplay wise. Storywise, I had feeling it would not be as good as 3, but it is almost there. I was more than satisfied and never felt a feeling in such a long while.

DMC Story rating, and Bayonetta, cuz why not:
  1. DMC 3
  2. Bayonetta 2
  3. DMC 5
  4. Bayonetta
  5. DMC 4
  6. DMC 1
  7. DMC 2
  8. DmC
  9. Anime
 
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